Submitted by Graham Mason on
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I feel quite excited about finding this web site as the question of what is the real difference between sex and love making has always plagued my mind.
So many spiritual teachers skirt around the issue of man and woman. Its almost like noone want to get honest. For me its at the forefront of my existance the draw towards union with woman which never seems to come about. Somewhere along the line the wheels seem to fall off.
Along the way I have bumped into 2 teachers with whom I have found some insite regarding the orgasm issue: -
Barry Long
Bernie Prior
I see a number of references to Barry on this web site, but surprisingly nothing on Bernie who has the advantage that he is still alive and its possible to go to a workshop with him. He travels all over the world and is worth going to see if you have the chance. his web site is www.bernieprior.org.
I am curious if there is anyone on this site who knows of him.

Welcome Graham!

Yes, I have visited Bernie's website in the past. It's beautiful. As I recall, I didn't find much in the way of practical information about making love differently. If I'm wrong about this, I hope you'll furnish a link.

Based on my own experience, changing intention alone isn't enough to make relationships consistently loving. This may be because our subconscious mating program will seek to fulfill its objectives (more progeny, more varied progeny) whatever beautiful language and goals our rational minds are focusing on.

I started this site to share more about our underlying mammalian mating program and how it ties into the ancient advice on making love without conventional orgasm. See, for example, http://www.reuniting.info/science/coolidge_effect

Looking forward to your further posts. Let me know if you want to blog. By the way, we try to keep promotional posts to a minimum. There's a "commercial" section for them in the Forum.

Yes, you are spot on. After

Yes, you are spot on. After attending a few of Bernies retreats I found him fairly long on rhetoric but not a lot on the nitty gritty of love making. He gives very lengthy talks which can contain some divine insights, and they focus more on the spiritual side of the relationship between man and woman.

A lot of what he talks about is similar to David Deida, but he advises quite strongly against the idea of exploring woman's orgasm. Sometimes the man fascinates me, and other time he bores me totally with the lengths of his talks which sometimes tend to turn into incomprehensible sermons. Nevertheless, he is quite sincere and works hard travelling the world. I am greatful for the way he has installed in me a greater appreciation of woman and my relationships.

Sorry if posted in an inappropriate category. It was difficult to decide which section was most appropriate. Bloging sound interesting. What do I do?

Thanks for clarifying

I'm quite intrigued by Prior's advice about not bringing women to orgasm. That advice is rare on this planet these days. I had to find out that piece the hard way. Smile Only later did I discover that others had also stumbled upon that insight. For example:

http://www.reuniting.info/karezza_method_lloyd/womans_need_for_orgasm

And Alice Bunker Stockham, who insisted that Karezza (controlled intercourse) applied to both partners: http://www.reuniting.info/karezza_stockham.

I've read some of Deida's work, and he always seems to be moaning about how emotionally volatile the women in his life are. There could be a connection between that observation and his focus on female orgasm.

Just about anyone can blog upon request. You're now "good to go. Here are the instructions:
http://www.reuniting.info/resources/bloggers

A Courtly Companion may take a big longer, as the men on the site are so far bolder than the women.

Bernie

Hi, I'm new to the forum, but not new to the subject. Thank you for a beautiful site!

I was glad to find Bernie Prior's name in this forum! I have followed him (attending satsangs and one retreat) for 3 years now, and you are right: he is mostly working on the spiritual side and not giving much practical advice how to behave in the bedroom. If you check out his DVD "Commitment to love" though, you'll find some great parts (particularly disc 2 with questions and answers).

When you find Bernie boring is when you listen to him with the mind. When listening from the heart - it is possible to unite with the universe during his satsangs! He is a spiritual master and just being in his presence raises your consciousness to higher levels whether you are aware of it or not! =) I always drop into deep samadhi when he's being around, and I am very greatful for his teachings on the relationship between male and female.

The main insight I've gotten from him is that there's only One Woman and One Man in this universe - expressed as a variety of male and female bodies in this existence. Lovemaking actually occurs between that One Woman and One Man all the time, but as long as we are in our minds, we feel separate and believe we are only making love to the partner we currently have. To realize that bigger picture in the deep and not just intellectually, there has to be an inner marriage of the male and female forces (call it Yin-Yang or Shiva-Shakti or Snake-Eagle... whatever). That inner marriage is promoted by NOT having orgasm or traditional sex as recommended on this lovely site. What it leads to is a higher spiritual realm where Oneness eventually is realized. From where I sit, I see Bernie talk about the goal (to realize what True Love is) and not the means. By taking the people listening back to sense the Real during his satsangs (get a touch of Stillness and Love), a "map" is drawn in consciousness so that we will have an easier journey when we try to find that way by ourselves in his (physical) absence.

I do believe the intention is the most powerful tool to progress on this journey of finding deeper love. A clear intention with imperfect trial and error actions in bed is by far way better than perfect actions according to the book without intention.

The intention is a longing to find something deeper than the shallow pleasure on the physical level. When we are tired of getting what we WANT in a selfish manner we get this inner calling to search something deeper and more real - but in order to get that... we will have to give up ourselves as egotistical needy persons caught up in body, time and space... and realize we are universal timeless beings on our way home...